Michael David Wilson 0:28

Welcome to This Is Horror, a podcast for readers, writers and creators. I'm Michael David Wilson. In every episode alongside my co host, Bob Pastorella. We chat with the world's best writers about writing, life lessons, creativity, and much more. Now, today's episode is a little different, because it is a collaboration with my friend and the host of The Arc party podcast. Robb Olson, perhaps best known for the 10 years or so that he was a podcaster for boat podcast. And together with Robb, I am going to be chatting with another good friend and a phenomenally talented writer. Match spoof sad now acts as a brand new collection out today from Apocalypse party press. It is entitled abnormal statistics. And it is for that reason that me and Robb Olson decided to sit down and chat with Matt spoof. Now as we've almost every time I chat we're mags be on or off air. The conversation did quickly descend into absolute chaos and innuendo. Within the first few minutes. Though, you won't be able to tell from the rather sensible episode that I'm about to present to you. However, after the outro if you choose to accept this, then you can prepare for around 17 minutes of outtakes and absolute chaos. So before we jump into things, let us have a quick advert break.

Bob Pastorella 2:24

impoverished college dropout, Nick is desperate for money, so he signs up for highly experimental study at the isolated Drug Corp compound. Nick knows the study involves improving the human genome to extend life and he knows it involves some minor abdominal surgery, but he isn't prepared for the strange after effects the nausea the itching, the unusual abdominal swelling, the internal squirming now available in paperback from mother horror and cemetery gates media Book number six and a my dark library line corporate body by our A Busbee, author Carson winter presents soft targets and develop new word horror out March 22. From tenebrous press a pair of Office drones to discover a loophole in time that makes some days less real than others, allowing them to act on their darkest impulses without fear of reprisal. Their morals become more slippery and their fantasies more violent. And soon they have to decide what line they won't cross soft targets in timely reality bending novella about the easing surrender to violence and the addictive appeal of tragedy is entertainment. More information at tenebrous press.com.

Michael David Wilson 3:27

Okay, well, with that said, Here it is. It is max booth stern, and special guest Rob Olson on desses hora. Welcome to This Is Horror arc party edition, we are going to be talking to max booth. And today I've got my co host, Rob Olson, formerly of booked podcast now of arc party. Rob, tell us a little bit about yourself and the arc party concept.

Robb Olson 4:08

Sure. So I have been doing podcasts since April of 2011. Primarily I was doing book reviews and author interviews. And that was with booked booked ended in the in our 10th year on our 10th anniversary. We ended that podcast and now the new podcast is called the arc party. And essentially the idea of this is instead of a review podcast, it is pre publication promotion with authors so you have a book that's coming out. It's not out yet. I talk to you and we talk about the book and just kind of get people aware of stuff before it's out so they can preorder and engage with their libraries and stuff like that.

Michael David Wilson 4:51

Yeah, and so today, we are going to be counting with Mac spoof. He will be releasing In a matter of days, abnormal statistics is short story collection from Apocalypse party press. And so I mean, normally, with Arc party, you put these out quite a bit ahead of the release. I mean, you recently spoke to Cassandra core, and then you book isn't coming out until May. But with Max, this is going to go live. And then the next day, you can buy abnormal statistics. Now, it may be, because it took quite a long time to actually have a date that was ready for us to record this. It may not be night could be one of the reasons. But anyway, Max is here. Now, Max, how you doing?

Max Booth III 5:52

I just want to say, I've been ready to do this for a while. And Rob has as well.

Robb Olson 6:03

taking you out,

Michael David Wilson 6:05

people can read between the lines. I'm neither confirming nor denying the reasons you can come up with your own conclusions. But so you got abnormal statistics coming out in a few days. Yeah. So I mean, how did this one come about? How did you first land the collection with Apocalypse party press?

Max Booth III 6:34

Yeah. So I became I became a real of Apocalypse a few few years ago. And then who, who runs apocalypse, emailed me this, this tell me basically, that he was a fan of perpetual motion machine, my press, and how it had kind of inspired him to begin his own press. Because at the time, I was also looking at a shitty nine to five job while also trying to do this press. He also has a similar type of job. And you found that kind of motivational and I thought that was a cool thing to read from someone. So they will always in the back of my mind. And it helped the apocalypse releases really cool books, like negative space by BL Yego. On bonding by Maggie Sybil, most of the books I've read by Apocalypse are super cool. And they have a pretty just nice vibe to them that I enjoy. So I forget what led to me submitting a collection to them. But I knew I wanted to get one out. I didn't want to self publish it. Like I've done a lot of my books recently. Because I just don't have as much time it seems. So I was thinking that presses I thought might be interested. So I hit up apocalypses see if they might be interested in I have a collection. And I think I mentioned the possibility of just doing a novella as well. Ben seemed interested in if all those so I went through and I compiled a collection that I sent it over till it was pretty long. Also had a shitty title that I can't even remember all now it was a bad title. I sent them the collection that he accepted that. And then as we will go in through edits, we kind of discovered old man, many of them had a theme of dysfunctional families. So once we realize this is something I didn't even think about until he pointed it out. But once this was something we both knew was in the collection, it made it really easy to go through and trim the collection quite a bit to cut away the STRALIS that did not fit the theme. So I think the original collection was like 80,000 builds long. And we cut it down to I think, like 51,000 and ley line, I finished third novella in the ANA def song. And originally I was just going to release it as a standalone. But I kind of had this epiphany that it was perfect for this collection because it was almost like, like assembly of every other silly vibe wise and it just felt like it had a good home in that collection. So I hit up Ben and sent him the novella. And so what do you think about including this in the collection, he liked it, he loved it. We put it in the collection and it shot up to like 78,000 rooms, which is good because maybe 51,000 was not quite long enough in In retrospect, so I'm pretty happy with the length it is now. And I'm glad we ended up cutting so much, which allowed the room to add this novella.

Michael David Wilson 10:10

Yeah. And I mean, in terms of the collection, I feel that it's a very fair reflection of the kind of Brant for your writing style and story aesthetics, because, I mean, Indiana def sang has to be up there with the absolute bleakest things that you've ever written. I mean, there's still there is still some humor in it. But, you know, I think the darkness definitely overshadows that. I just say, having read the script as well. Which are we allowed to talk about? I mean, you wrote a script for it. Can we say that?

Max Booth III 10:53

Yeah, I've written I've written a script adaptations, but it's not with anyone. So I just read it on spec. And hopefully, we will sell it to someone in the future.

Michael David Wilson 11:05

Yeah, the script for me, it seems to have more comedic elements, then, you know, and then a valid and a valid definitely was tonally darker, I would say. But then, I mean, in contrast to Indiana def saying, you have stories like fish, which is pretty much just like, comedic, throughout. And I mean, it seems to be with your fiction, yeah, you typically have these two modes where you've got, like, we need to do something because you know, in that darker mode, but then you've got something like carnivorous lunar activities, which is much more comedic. So, I mean, was that something you were conscious of? When you and Ben were putting the collection together that you wanted to be able to showcase these two sides of your writing?

Max Booth III 12:04

I still think it was something we discussed I thought much about with this collection, because most of my shield fiction tends to be on the legal side. And most of it, I don't think has a lot of comedy. Like thought I would say yeah, there's some bits and pieces throughout that have comedic moments. But I will say my my, my novels, my my big books, they tend to have a lot more comedy in them because at least with me, most of my comedy tends to happen when I have a long amount of time to develop kill to build so you get the annual Stan like how they behave. And then you get the hat, you get the add these jokes through the dialogue and behaviors. But with short fiction, you don't really have that time to develop that way. And plus, with this collection, I think I just wanted it to be like, This is our whole collection. So that made it pretty easy to not include some of my comedic shield stories, because I do have some, usually anytime I've written a comedic Schiltz really or flash fiction, it was filmed like a public reading I was doing because I think when you do a like a reading, it should be comedic. So I've written a lot of stuff like that specifically with the intention of reading it out loud. But then that's in the collection, and I can see how fish could be pretty funny. I don't think I intended it to be that way. But I can also see how it just is funny. Like, if that was made into a movie, I'm pretty sure it would be not that silly, a speaker. A kid just cracking a woman who's menstruating endlessly.

Robb Olson 14:03

Yeah, it's definitely absurd. And I think the third ism leads to humor. Yeah.

Michael David Wilson 14:08

Yeah, I particularly love your story note for fish because most of the story notes, you've got some long winded not long winded like Lankan kind of answer as to how you came about this. And I'm just gonna find the exact wording given how I I pretty much know this sentence. We've finish the story notes, Joe. I lost my virginity to an older woman on her period. Sometimes it's as simple as that, folks.

Max Booth III 14:46

I mean, I think that's a pretty good lesson feel stressful. You're telling any experiment in spiraling spiraling right old southville. You know that maybe they listen to this podcast Phil. Advice I'm having right now. And that's something I would tell them, you know, the most innocent innocence experience could lead to a great start really just such as losing your virginity to an older woman that'll feel it, you can write a story about monster lady who corrupts the child into killing families. Yeah, why not?

Michael David Wilson 15:26

So good and not very specific. I

Max Booth III 15:32

think the

anecdote was was in on writing by Stephen King to

Robb Olson 15:41

hear so about that, though, like, what not about that, but about from my perspective of reading this. And we'll get into this probably deeper when we start talking about some of the stories, but when I read some of this, I definitely picked up on the autobiographical nature of it. And so like, and obviously, you said that this was inspired by, you know, a real experience. And then my mind automatically starts asking, like, did the woman he lost his virginity to convince him to start murdering people? Or like, was that a lot? You know what I'm saying? So like, with this collection, I guess what I'm saying is, there's a lot of stuff that seems like it's informed from you. And it's obvious kind of usually where the barrier is, but sometimes it's like, I don't know.

Max Booth III 16:31

I think pretty much anything I've written has that element to it have been recycled from my own life, and then kind of Frankensteined into something else. Like with fish specifically? Yes, I did end up killing a few kids. The names were different. So that's kind of like, you know, I'm able to be creative with it.

Robb Olson 16:58

It's the sketching the names.

Max Booth III 17:00

I mean, I don't have to, but like, the names in real life just didn't seem that fun to read. So you want to change it? So the results like ah, this is, this is entertaining. Yeah.

Michael David Wilson 17:16

And I think with fish ants with, I mean, all of your stories, like the pacing is great, you always have such a kind of sense of, you know, getting that story progressing from B to B, it is all very kind of lean, I guess. What good old Richard Thomas would refer to as trimming the fat. And I mean, I think as well there's a there's a definite sense of escalation because whilst it starts off as pretty comedic in my opinion, then like, you know, when the horror kicks in, and that kind of final act Oh, it really ramps up very quickly, indeed.

Max Booth III 18:01

Oh, thank you. I am glad you picked up on that, Michael. I don't know what to say. But I mean, thank you. Pacing, I think is something that's pretty essential and I think it can be difficult to get right. But I don't know maybe just one way to do that is to have a ladder a lot of Manik animoji So we write the Australia kind of matches that at some point. Something I just remembered all about fish. And I think it's kind of funny is there's a section of that straightaway that describes someone's face caving in like a ratting pumpkin and I just remember build for a long time when I was a teenager I will use that same description a lot. Specifically writing pomp and Colette collapsing to describe a face getting just crushed. I don't know what was going on with that. I think I just like I guess when you feel speak getting ready and you come up with something like by yourself that isn't just stolen from someone else. You kind of claim to that you use it as much as possible. But I recall like using that description quite a bit. I it also just hit me now as an afterthought that I do have a rallying pumpkin on my front filtrate now I just from last Halloween I forgot to do anything with it. And like last week, it was still fine. And then like within a couple days it just fucking flattened to this black caucus. And I don't know what to do with it now.

Michael David Wilson 19:47

Yeah. You when You discovered that and then subsequently, so the photo of the pumpkin aftermath I can put that in the show notes for people You're interested?

Max Booth III 20:01

Yeah. My dogs keep trying to eat it. I wish I was on a laptop, I could just walk outside and show you but I'm on a desktop. So I think if I unplugged it, I would lose video access.

Michael David Wilson 20:15

Yeah, that. Definitely.

Max Booth III 20:20

So, those watching and Matt, imagine this is a pumpkin. That's it.

Michael David Wilson 20:32

All right. We've discovered collection. Obviously, there was quite a bit of discussion then in terms of what to and what not to include, given that you submitted well, over 100,000 words or so, initially. So, I mean, what did that process look like? And were there any stories that Ben particularly wanted you not to include that you were adamant like? No, this absolutely goes in or vice versa.

Max Booth III 21:07

Now, it was the opposite. I think after we did it, I came up with a list. I think he also maybe came up with a list of ones he thought could be removed. And I'm not really precious about my writing, usually. So I mean, if someone will not just anyone, but him specifically, I trusted him. Me. I think he has good taste. And he was publishing it. So anything he suggested, I was pretty quick to remove some of mine, he was like, well, maybe we should keep this one. I was like, man, I was just fucking cut it. Yeah, it was one that the last one we cut. It's called flowers blooming in the season of atrophy. And that was my really feels propane publication. It was in Michael Bailey's a chiral. Mad to anthology. I ended up cutting it, he thought maybe it should stay but at the sight of the candidate, because the well not because of the plot, the plot is basically about a school shooting. That happens. But he was a little too positive, I think, which sounds funny. But it's the way it's written is written, like a little bit to Disney and spiraling. It's about a school shooting that's prevented. But the way it's written, there's just didn't seem to fit the same vibe. And I don't think I would have written it that way now. And I don't know. I mean, I'm still I look back fondly on it because of the the it being my family feels pro publication. But beyond that, I don't know. going back and reading again for the collection that just didn't sit. Right. And the only other Australian that really comes to mind that we did leave, but I was really on the fence about for the longest time was a zombie strictly called in the attic of the universe. What the fuck is that?

Michael David Wilson 23:13

Hell yeah, it's a tiny URL in the attic of the universe.

Max Booth III 23:17

So that's a super old theory that I was afraid just wasn't written. Well. I wrote it. I think when I was a teenager, I can't remember it all now. So I was afraid it was just wasn't the same quality, but Ben seemed to like it. And I liked the idea of having something from way back then, in the collection filled people really into kind of, like, compel how, hopefully my I've improved as a rental throughout the last decade or so. And yeah, I mean, I think that's okay. Like, I love Stephen King collections, especially the fields like three or fill collections of hands. And something that would always be cool is like seeing like the decades each one was originally published them. It would I always found that kind of neat. The trace, like the history of saving Keynes relays.

Robb Olson 24:11

If I could say one thing about that particular zombie story, I would say that, and this is just me reflecting on because I read the book about maybe a month ago. It seems like that story has a lot of hearts. Like it's got a lot more I don't know like positive kind of vibes to like relationships, like interactions between people, even though it's like a terrible situation. And while you were describing it, I was thinking to myself, There's got to be some kind of like, hope somewhere in this book because a lot of it gets pretty bleak. So that's that's kind of like my first thought that I that came to mind when you when you were talking about it was there does seem to be a little bit more of like a positivity to that story than maybe a lot of the other ones.

Max Booth III 25:00

Yeah, I mean, I guess I hadn't grown yet as a royalty discount. No hope.

Michael David Wilson 25:08

So I was thinking, as Rob was saying, it's like, you know, you wrote that one when you were younger. So you were you were less jaded, or one might say, less aware of the world. So that was a little bit more optimism. And then as you got older, it's like, no, no,

Max Booth III 25:24

it's pretty. I mean, looking back, I'm pretty fond of the premise it has for those listening. The premise of this really is zombie apocalypse, is a man living in this attic with his child is a baby. And oh, shit, I forgot the Yeah, he's been sooner or later, he's gonna, he's gonna become fucking zombified. And this baby is going to be left alone. So he has the dilemma. What do I do? Do I just let this baby go and see what happens? Or do I shoot my baby and then shoot myself? I mean, that's something I tend to approach a lot with many of these civilians is coming up with this really fucked up dilemma or situation they've someone's found themselves in and exploring how they react, I guess.

Michael David Wilson 26:21

Yeah, yeah. I think I probably found this more traumatic than I would have if I'd have read it before becoming a father, because I'm really trying to put myself in this situation and decide, well, what the hell would I do? Because, I mean, yeah, you've effectively got the ultimatum. Well, do I take care of this issue? You know, and the baby will be no more or do do I kind of exit and, and hope or don't know that it's pretty unlikely that something good that you know, will happen? But yeah, yeah, is

Max Booth III 27:09

I'll tell you what just ended my brain as you will talk. And you said ultimatum, and killed to me that, you know, some people say tomato, tomato, tomato. He did, like, ultimatum ultimatum. That's why I began laughing as you will talk here, because suddenly, I couldn't stop thinking about that. I apologize. But this is ALC PLD. Baby. This is what happened. A little too loose with the coffee.

Michael David Wilson 27:43

Yeah, yeah. Well, I mean, thank you for sharing that. So.

Max Booth III 27:51

I mean, I don't know who else I could have told. So.

Robb Olson 27:56

No one's gonna think of ultimatum the same way ever again. Yeah. I suppose.

Max Booth III 28:05

Oh, that's great.

Michael David Wilson 28:07

I mean, Rob, if you are in this situation, with your hypothetical GI or domain, what do you think you would do?

Robb Olson 28:16

Alright, so I'm going to tell you a quick story. So I don't have my own children. But I've, the person I've been dating for the last two and a half years has kids that are eight and 13. And so I've known these kids for a couple of years now. And I really care about them. And the the older one recently was like chasing the cat or something like that, and then turned quickly and like, hit their head on the doorframe. And it was very frightening in the moment, obviously, they ended up being fine, but we had to take them to the emergency room and everything. And the I'd never felt like such horror, and such like a feeling of just, I don't want this person to feel this way. That, you know, to two years ago, if you asked me that question, I think my response would have been way different than now. Because like, you never want to see your kid suffer. And so it is like this kind of impossible situation where it's like, I am I is it weak to not do the thing to prevent future suffering? Or is it weak to do the thing? Like, there's there's no answer. So I think that two years ago, I would have been like, oh, it's easy to just, you know, do the right thing and prevent the kid from suffering in the future. But now, I don't know if I I don't know if I would be able to, to do that, you know? Yeah.

Max Booth III 29:43

Yeah. What about you, Michael, what would you do?

Michael David Wilson 29:46

I think in general, despite whenever I encounter really difficult situations, and you know, I've had a few in the last few years. I'm a relentless optimist. So I just I think, you know, I could kill the kid because there's gonna be that bit of hope that something good might happen in the end. I mean, imagine to if you decide to kill the kid and you can feel yourself turning, but then like it you never actually fully turn and then you realize later you have this rare mutation. You could never turn but oh,

Max Booth III 30:27

maybe it's like, oh wait, being a zombie is awesome. I need a bite my kids so they can join me. This is actually pretty great.

Michael David Wilson 30:37

I think too. I mean, the optimism even if I turn, it might be that lights. You know, it's not zombies who discover the kid. And imagine if you had killed your kid, and someone else what to discover them so yeah, I think I had I don't know, what would you do? Like maybe barricade the room as much as you can, but maybe also in the house and be like, you know, write a note kid in bathroom because I assume that like zombies aren't that good at reading and comprehending, but if a non zombie turns up our kid in bathroom, okay, well

Max Booth III 31:24

says, Kid please bathroom open. That's a Walking Dead joke. It reminds me now thinking about it. The end of the missed the film adaptations? Have you guys both seen the movie?

Michael David Wilson 31:44

I have? Yeah.

Max Booth III 31:46

Oh my god. Okay, I don't know how to talk about this movie now. spoil the ending.

Robb Olson 31:56

So if you if you're worried about spoiling it for me, don't worry about it, go for it.

Max Booth III 31:59

So the miss it ends with the husband, the five all he's driving away with his kid and a bunch of other people who have survived this apocalyptic health thing that's happening. While driving into the midst. They decide we'll just keep driving, but then the thing ran out of gas. And they will surrounded by the mist and all the creatures around them. And they have a gun with enough bullets to kill everybody but one. So they decide, okay, the man he shoots everybody, including his son. And now let's just him. So he runs out after killing his fucking son, and then sees Oh, the mist is going away and the government has come to save them all. So that just brought to mind the ending. And now it's really hilarious to me imagining like, what the next scene was like. Trying to explain this mass homicide he committed. Yeah.

Robb Olson 33:06

Wow.

Max Booth III 33:06

He probably went to prison. Yeah. Yeah. Split a little time, the mist.

Robb Olson 33:16

was good to call out spoilers after you're talking about. Yeah.

So every breath is a choice. All I'm gonna say is like, there is there is one word in that story. And it is the best word in the entire book. If you asked me, I did not see the ending of this story coming. And the twist happens in the very last word. And I got through this whole story. And I got to that last word. And I was like, yes, it was like the most satisfying like, like, I did not see it coming. And even like so is building and building and like. So like the premise for people who are listening who didn't read this already, is there's a guy who I'm on the right story, right? There's a guy who this guy breaks into his family's house and like, gives the guy a choice. The guy walks in on all this happened and gives the guy the choice. Like he has to choose whether the guy kills the wife or the kid. Yeah, so like, that's the premise of the story. And then without spoiling too much like, you know, this guy's life just kind of like crumbles apart after that. And it's just this pathetic kind of sad, sad person. And the way that you ended the story, though, that turn that you take never saw coming and it was just so perfect and powerful. I was really impressed by the like, how you really led me in the path of like, this guy is just like, trudging through this sad existence. I never saw that ending coming and it was probably for me the most. Even though Indiana Death songs fucked me up crazy, like this story was probably had the most powerful moment for me in the whole book.

Max Booth III 35:08

Thank you that I forget when I wrote it exactly, but they had a difficult time getting accepted any place. In fact, the the anthology that didn't publish it, it was accepted by someone who had rejected it like five years previously. But then they accepted it this time. I don't know why. But I don't have a lot of memories are real that idea even came from but I do recall struggling a bit with what to do with it because I had the initial premise of someone has to make its decision of who dies wife or child, but didn't know what to do beyond that. So I remember once the the second half the ending coming to mind, that's when everything clicked. I got pretty excited about writing. They I do think I spent a long time trying to figure out what happens after the initial thing that happens happens.

Michael David Wilson 36:12

Yeah, I mean, maybe one reason as well that you found this one kind of more personally effective than Indiana def sang. It's just like, it's a premise that one can anyone can easily relate to. Whereas I guess we're Deanna deaf sang it. Whilst you know, you can empathize to some level unless you've had that kind of childhood, then that there's like that other layer that makes it harder to to fully put yourself in that position. But

Max Booth III 36:47

yeah, that'd be this premise. Specifically, I imagined and something everyone has put themselves through, like, it's a mind game almost Okay, of my family, who would I save? That's basically what this is.

Robb Olson 37:01

With that, but that second, like, it's interesting that you say that it took you a while to come to that, like the conclusion to come to that conclusion, and figure out what the ending of that story was going to be because masterful, but like I can imagine you were just like struggling with that story. And then one day, you were just like, This is it. So yeah,

Max Booth III 37:21

I mean, we have a simple fact that thing that happens, but you can't that's just that can't be all that happens in Australia. Well, it's gonna be incomplete feeling.

Robb Olson 37:30

Right? Yeah, exactly. Like they're like, what's the point? You just, you've just given a hypothetical, but like the what you did, it makes it more of a story makes it more? Yeah, I agree.

Michael David Wilson 37:43

Thank you, in terms of like, you know, coming up with endings is that like, a lot of writers kind of tend to struggle with that. Is that something that is particularly difficult for you? Because you you generally fucking nearly does it like on on the page? It doesn't seem to be a difficult thing, but I know like how much we can kind of labor onto like sticking that ending and getting it right. Yeah.

Max Booth III 38:16

Oh, thank you. I appreciate that. I think about endings a lot with a shields really, I don't begin writing anything until I know the ending typically the ending comes first. Except in the example of every breath is a choice I have the beginning before I had an ending. But if I don't know the ending, especially in the shield straily it's just gonna come across as aimless thing I think, but it's good to have like, I mean, I look at like writing a joke, you need to have the punch line even if the punch in this case the punch line is usually something horrific is still a punch line. And then you can't write the build up to that unless you know what it is and then you can come up with the beginning and then everything else leading to that with books I sometimes have an idea in mind. I usually have a vague sense of how I want it to end I don't always have like a concrete idea within the death song no fucking idea how that was going to end which is probably why it took me so long right? If I imagine if I had come up with an N then before I wrote it I would have finished it quite quickly all but that wasn't the case. But yeah, I think and then I mean, the ending is the last thing you read so if it's a bad end then you will not going to have good memories of that silly even as shitty silly with a good entity and it's going to leave okay impression on you.

Michael David Wilson 39:59

Yeah, Yeah. And I just wanted to go back to something you said earlier about when you're doing live readings, it's important to find a comedic piece. And that's something that, you know, I completely agree with. But if you're doing something like promoting, you know, Indiana def sang, or we need to do something, so pretty bleep stories. What what's your approach there? Would would you just read, like a complete story on that kind of tour that has nothing to do with the book? Or would you take? Yeah, yeah. I,

Max Booth III 40:42

I've thought about this a lot. And I don't know what the right solution is. Because it's, it's, I agree. It's almost like false advertising. Maybe like, this is not the type of book you're going to be buying. Yeah, I've read one section of Indiana death song out loud to an audience. And I think the audience liked it. I didn't enjoy the experience. It was a so last year, convention in Austin called the kill all CON. Read a section from it at that. Now, we haven't talked about this the valley yet, but it was mostly about my own experience as a teenager, with my mom and dad, and the week of kill con, my mom died. And then I went to kill all CON and I read a sexual format. And I think I was a fucking maniac. As I was reading it. I was definitely on the village of just falling to pieces. And I guess being overly emotional is a possibility when you will really need something supercilious. And that could have its good sides, I think. But I don't tend to write a lot of stuff that quite taps that way. Maybe I do. I don't know. I don't think I have enough pieces that you can read without context that have that type of motion or vein, the Poke. That was comedy, I don't know. You require less context, I think, when you will really like a flash fiction comedic piece than you would something super bleak. Maybe it's also possible. I'm just talking right now without thinking. But I think I'm making sense. I'll give you an example of what I plan on reading. Next week. So I'm doing a few book related reading events next week. And I to promote this collection. And I plan on writing a new flash flash fiction piece. I haven't written it yet. But I have it in my head, what I'm going to write, and it has nothing to do with this collection. But I think it's going to be pretty funny. I'll tell you the silly idea and what happens in it because it's therefore going to be published in the place. It's just going to be something I read out loud. So a while ago, I got obsessed with this tweet. This woman posted. I'm trying to remember the exact phrasing, but it's basically like this woman tweeted how hobby loves, loves it when she puts three soft boiled eggs, pill vagina, and then the husband then like licks up the egg juices, I think something like that. It's really fucking gross. But it's it's amazing the way the vivid images that come to mind when I read this tweet, so the idea I have is I'm gonna read Schiltz really about this a flash fiction about this man who also reads the tweet, he is going to begin with them just Joe was just laughing it out, like, aha, that's a gross tweet. But then he's gonna not be able to stop thinking about it. And he's gonna begin joking with his wife. Like, that would be crazy if you did that, right. But then it's gonna not be just a joke. It's gonna be him. Like, come on. We could try. And it happens. They do it. And he loves it. It's the best fucking thing in the universe, if he's so obsessed with these egg juicers, that the ending is going to be him crawling into his wife's womb and living inside the grill. So that's, that's what I'm going to read the Promote abdominal statistics. right move.

Michael David Wilson 44:36

The right move, but

Max Booth III 44:37

that's what I'm thinking. Okay. I think I'll call it three eggs.

Michael David Wilson 44:43

I know. I can hold free I knew as soon as you said this toy tirade, I knew exactly.

Max Booth III 44:56

Yeah, I don't know how that translates. A people buying this collection. Like, I mean, someone might enjoy the reading via this and get home and go, What the fuck is this? You know, I might be losing in the audience by stealing away people with reading something like that because the collection isn't like that. But I don't know what else to do. Because I think like task number one when doing a live reading, is to entertain. You don't want to read anything that puts someone to sleep. So to me the idea to come up with something fucking strange and hopefully funny and unforgettable. And three eggs, I believe it's gonna be that type of stuff. Really?

Michael David Wilson 45:41

Yeah. Yeah, I feel. I feel like if you do that, it's like, Look, if you've enjoyed this reading, and you're buying the book, based on that, maybe start by reading fish, you know, because specifically, because of three eggs, and then you just start with Indiana deficit is like, completely different mood. So I reckon not

Max Booth III 46:08

a single egg in that book. No eggs in the Deaf song at all. Yeah, that's true. Pretty odd.

Michael David Wilson 46:17

But, but I mean, the only other way you could do it is if you've got a live reading and if if you can somehow do two extracts, I don't know if like is, is this gonna be like an interview with readings and like, you know, you can stand up do one reading about 10 minutes later, you do another? I mean, the extract that probably would be most comedic is the elevator scene. You know, and again, kind of

Max Booth III 46:47

what I did matter, the cute little Can I read two sections, I read that scene to make people laugh. And then I read a section when I guess I can't talk about it. I read a much saddle section later on in the novella, and I think that was a pretty good like, one two punch, you get them laughing and then they will pay the tension and then you can go into the sad shit. So I do think those are players feel sad stuff to read. But you do need a hook them before you can, like, get them feeling anything.

Michael David Wilson 47:22

Yeah, yeah. And I think you know, with a live reading, you want to entertain the people, it's a different experience than just like, you know, sitting down and reading the book yourself. And, you know, I've had times where I've gone to readings and very accomplished writers have just like read like a section of supernatural horror, where it's very dense, it's very natural fanfic. You know, just just reading this very, kind of prose heavy description. In doesn't, it doesn't really feel like it translates well, for a live reading. That's not where I'm gonna get the most out of that. But if you've got something comedic or you've got something dialogue heavy, then you're gonna get my attention.

Max Booth III 48:22

Yeah, even the times I've read like sections from a book that was published, I always take that section to a build, document and revise it. So it makes more sense to read out loud. Like, I have a speech impediment. So usually when I do that, I tried to remove anything that I know I'm not gonna say correctly. Oh, if I have too much exposition, I cut that and just like just like the fucking the bill bones of what I need to get across is when I read out loud,

Michael David Wilson 48:52

that's exactly what me and Bob did. For the launch of They're Watching, I took a section between the protagonist and the PI character, and I just basically formatted it like a script. And it's like, right, that's what we're reading.

Robb Olson 49:09

And this is a David James Keaton story. So take that with however much salt you need to take that with. But um, one thing I've noticed about him with live readings, because I've attended several of his is that sometimes he'll just do some sort of, this is something that happened to me recently, you know, as as like a thing he's talking about before he goes into a story. So like, I think if you're going just grim if you had some sort of entertaining anecdote, that was real life, before going into just grim like that could be a way to soften up the crowd without like, you know, necessarily having another piece because, like, he really got he there was one time in Chicago where he got basically the whole audience like just really railing against the Chicago parking authority people, because he had this really compelling story about like you In his car towed, and then he went into the thing he was the heck's his actual story. So like, I think that too could be a way to hook people in and get them on your side before. But here's the thing. caveat, I don't I'm not an author, I never have to stand up and read one of my things. So like, you know, I take that, take that how you will, but I thought he was good at that as far as like being entertaining and get the audience on your side.

Max Booth III 50:23

Yeah, that sounds like a good method. I've never met Keaton. I've never will see him read. But just his own, like his style of prose feels fairly conversational. So I bet you Yeah, he's, uh, he probably does great public readings. Something I've been debating trying to do one day soon at some events, is doing improv reading. Basically, just having someone tell me like a few things about what Australia can be about. And just fucking tells Julie full 10 minutes. I'm pretty sure I could do it. But it's just depends. When? Because I think that would be interesting.

Michael David Wilson 51:02

Yeah, yeah. I love that idea. And anything that's gonna make for a unique experience as well it, you know, that's a reason to go to that reading. And yeah, what you're describing it almost sounds like kind of Whose Line Is It Anyway, kind of old TV comedy style to it? Yeah, I'd be I'd be totally up for like an event like that, where you've got three or four readers and they're each given a different prompt. I mean, maybe you take like, the prompt out of a hat or whatever, like, got three eggs, but you know, it could be any anything. So yeah, yeah.

Max Booth III 51:46

I think that's called like an exquisite coop's. Right. Will you continue someone else's through?

Michael David Wilson 51:51

Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

Robb Olson 51:54

Any piece of art that like one person starts it and then like, someone picks up where they left off? Yeah. Yeah.

Max Booth III 52:01

It would be fun to do that. But also have someone else assigned just for editing. Like, if, so they can just yell, stop and run out. Okay, this is really a this is not real. Hey, let's do this again. I guess, like a movie director, almost. But still, that can be a fun bit to do on stage. Maybe I'll do that I do a monthly show in Austin called the ghoulish show. I have people come out and do performances on stage. Usually comedic to a crowd so now I'm thinking that would be a good a very good time to do that. One of these days at that show is to do it. I live Exquisite Corpse so thanks for the idea, folks.

Michael David Wilson 52:43

Yeah, yeah, God if we wanted to practice it, we could probably get like a number of Ryan's together and just do do one of these on a podcast to see like how does it logistically work? And then depending how well it does or does not work would depend on whether we ever air it's it's fair. Thank you so much for listening to max booth on This Is Horror and the ark party podcast. In the near future. Both me and Rob Olson will be getting to Mac spoof again, to discuss and dissect the rest of the stories from abnormal statistics, including the incredible novella, Indiana def song. Now if you would like to get that and every episode ahead of the crowd, then do become a patron@patreon.com. Forward slash, This Is Horror. Not only are you going to get early bird access to each and every episode, but you can submit questions to guests that we have on the show. And coming up soon, we will be chatting to the likes of Grady Hendrix, Caroline, Katniss, and Joe R Lansdale. So head over to patreon.com forward slash, This Is Horror. Have a little look at what it is that we offer and see if it's a good fit for you. Now a special thanks to rob Olsen for doing this with me. Not only is he the host of the art party podcast, but as I said earlier for 10 years he wants to host alongside Livia Sneden have booked podcast now I've said this before, but booked podcast was one of the inspirations for This Is Horror Podcast. So without booked there may not have been a This Is Horror Podcast. And without booked I definitely would be no Michael David Wilson and Bob Pastorella together because I found became aware of Bob and his work through the book anthology. So do subscribe to Rob's podcast the arc party and do give the guy a lot of love because he deserves it. Such a good podcaster such a good human being. Okay, before I wrap up it is time for a quick advert break.

Bob Pastorella 55:27

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Michael David Wilson 56:31

Now next episode we will present a another This Is Horror awards episode. And this time it will be for the short story collection and the anthology of the year. So get ready and get excited for that one. Now, do not forget to show us some love on our social media channels. Particularly tick tock Twitter, and for video episodes YouTube. Now I believe you me you might want to catch this max move episode in video format, especially for the outtakes which are absolutely chaotic. Speaking of which they are coming up after the theme tune. So if you want to hear innuendo, sex talk, and general bullshit, then you are just minutes away. And if not, well mean I've warned you so you've had a turn off now. Put on a different podcast listen to a little bit of old gods of Appalachia or hawk and cleavers the other story why not give that reprobate Max boost podcast a little bit of a go ghoulish still with me? Well, again in the outtakes Then aren't you? So until next time, take care yourselves be good to one another or read horror. Keep on writing and have a great great day.

Max Booth III 59:00

You live in Japan. So the release date is even closer to you.

Michael David Wilson 59:09

I know. absolutely disgraceful. I mean, I was gonna say you need but doesn't it make sense to be talking to someone when you can actually buy the book? But I'm not gonna say that because then you know that would be hanging out my friend robots. And it's like so you've just this the podcast in the first few minutes. So that's why I haven't said that.

Robb Olson 59:35

Well, the our Venn diagram just doesn't really overlap much like I handle pre release, and you handle at or after release. And then you know there's just that little, maybe a little overlap but

Max Booth III 59:48

I handle release, mainly specify in releasing. That's my thing is I release. I'm not a fan of the pre release or the post release, but the The act of releasing, I'm pretty much a fan of,

Michael David Wilson 1:00:04

I think a fine hat, you know, I mean, obviously releases the best. But if I had to, you know, obviously do a lot of pre releasing or post releasing, I mean, post releases, probably better like particularly spends a lot of pre release.

Max Booth III 1:00:20

So the thing with post releases, I'm usually left kind of disappointed and ashamed. And pre release can be fun, like, especially like, if you're right on the edge of pre release, then you stop. But then after so long, you just kind of like a loose feeling and like the act of releasing, and then it's like, yeah, what's the point of even continuing? But right in those seconds of release, that's, that's the best.

Robb Olson 1:00:48

Well, so we know how you're gonna feel. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 1:00:52

I'm talking about

Michael David Wilson 1:00:54

that. You guys. Yeah. Yeah. Sure. Can yeah.

Max Booth III 1:01:07

Time to change this podcast to the compel the right. This is why you invited me

Robb Olson 1:01:16

or this is come I guess.

Max Booth III 1:01:19

That's pretty good. That's pretty good.

Michael David Wilson 1:01:23

And you regretting your decision to invite me honestly, the co host for this particular episode of Occupy I'll be honest, if we'd have been speaking to Joe Lansdale, this isn't this isn't how the episode would have started.

Robb Olson 1:01:39

Yeah, that's true.

Max Booth III 1:01:41

I'm gonna get Joe land cell on my podcast. I'm gonna ask him he's gonna say because he just I know him. And I'm gonna get him to talk about calm I spilled. I am that's my new mission is to get Joe Lansdale to do a podcast. But we mostly talk about the jack Hewlett. I think I can make it happen.

Michael David Wilson 1:01:59

I mean, if anyone can.

Max Booth III 1:02:01

That's my that's my edge. I will do it if we we sell. I don't know. 1000 copies of this book. Yeah. land sale the talking about come.

Michael David Wilson 1:02:14

Is there a timeline that these copies after resold or is it just at any point? Yeah.

Max Booth III 1:02:20

By by June 8, obviously. Okay.

Michael David Wilson 1:02:24

Oh, sorry. Yeah. 669. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well,

Max Booth III 1:02:29

I guess I guess Neville country. It'd be nine six. But, um, how many United States? Six? Nine. Yeah.

Robb Olson 1:02:37

So you're giving people to September 6, then.

Michael David Wilson 1:02:39

I mean,

Max Booth III 1:02:41

11. Line is at 911. Got

Robb Olson 1:02:53

Michael, Rob,

I'm letting you steer this thing. So yeah.

Michael David Wilson 1:02:59

I didn't now we're here to jump. Oh, I know you were letting me stay.

Robb Olson 1:03:06

I know. I'm sorry. Now, tell me what you'd like to do next. Because I think that I'm just gonna agree with it. But what would you like to do next? tell you why. In this case,

Max Booth III 1:03:25

I got next. Next step. What would you like to talk about Michael? How, how have you guys been? What's lifelike? Doing any fun practice lately, guys? I'm the host now I guess.

Robb Olson 1:03:48

Oh, all right. So I will, I will, I'm going to cut it and say and this could be cut out because this is kind of like maybe a little bit inside. But when I pitched the idea of doing this, Michael was like, Hey, I don't know how this is going to work. Because I'm like, I lead my thing. And you lead your thing. And, you know, I don't know how this is gonna go. And I think this is exactly what Michael was worried about was this specific moment. So it almost makes me happy that it happened. Because if it hadn't, if it hadn't, and it'd be like, oh, you know, but like, so it did. So that's good. You know, if they say get

Max Booth III 1:04:21

podcast hosts in one room and said a lot of you, you go ahead. That's what's happening with LMS right now. Yep. That's the age old saying.

Robb Olson 1:04:35

time immemorial

Michael David Wilson 1:04:37

I mean, I was gonna lead. I was gonna lead on to the next topic. But the fact that you stopped to ask me what I want to talk about, would imply to me that there's something that you want to talk about, Rob, what do you want to talk about? Oh, I

Robb Olson 1:04:57

mean, I think that the thing I came most prepared to do was like kind of throw in my insights about individual stories but I didn't know how much we're going to dive into individual stories versus like doing other stuff so if that's something that we're reserving for later on in the discussion I'm just all the chambers are loaded man I'm just letting you know he released time

Michael David Wilson 1:05:20

yeah

Max Booth III 1:05:22

I can see pre release leaking from a man

Michael David Wilson 1:05:28

oh my god

Unknown Speaker 1:05:30

yeah

Max Booth III 1:05:32

okay it's now I'm talking about calm right

Michael David Wilson 1:05:37

very excited about the pre release I mean, sometimes I'm podcasting your guest just walks off

Robb Olson 1:05:49

on ceremoniously Yeah,

Michael David Wilson 1:05:51

yeah, that's live podcast and for you sometimes but guess that's enough. Sorry about that. It's okay.

Max Booth III 1:06:00

Someone rang the doorbell or something.

Michael David Wilson 1:06:04

So a more sensible suggestion as to what happened and where I was going I was gonna tie in what we've been talking about and yet

Max Booth III 1:06:15

he can't come he has been close snips.

Robb Olson 1:06:19

So one of the words you can't say around your dog you have to like spell it out. So they don't know that's the word you're saying.

Max Booth III 1:06:25

Common I'm saying See you

Michael David Wilson 1:06:28

Yeah, yeah, hold dilemma how to spell comm

Max Booth III 1:06:36

I think we've had podcast episodes about this everyone.

Michael David Wilson 1:06:42

UMC yo me discussion? I mean that Yeah. So for those listening.

Max Booth III 1:06:47

Well, I think we decided on See you M is calm as a noun CLM. E is calm as a real and c o m e. A. s y o u a l e is a Nirvana song.

Robb Olson 1:07:10

Nation Yeah. Yes, I

Max Booth III 1:07:13

am on file today. That was not planned. Fuckin spontaneous. Next question. Let's go. I got it.

Michael David Wilson 1:07:21

Next question is for Rob. Do you have like a remote control webcam? Just happened?

Robb Olson 1:07:27

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so this is a combination. It's a confluence of two situations. So first of all, sometimes my office chair just goes like it lowers on its own. Yeah, and we'll set goes down but I knew how that was gonna go. So yes, I do have a remote controlled webcam. And so like, I can kind of modify where it's looking so I just wanted to make sure I was still framed up pretty nicely even though my chair betrayed me.

Michael David Wilson 1:07:57

Yeah, now assuming that this goes into the final episode, and that might be a fairly big assumption that this isn't edited. It might be a kind of good time to make people aware that we have video versions of the podcast as well because we're making quite a lot of references to what is visually going on. So I imagine to that the kind of broadcast is gonna be slightly different depending on whether you're viewing the This Is Horror YouTube, or the Ark party YouTube because I mean with us we go for like whoever speaking the camera is on them. But I don't know what your plan is. But if you're going to actually edit it together as you usually do, then you're gonna see all cameras for your view, which actually, I mean, I wouldn't normally direct my listeners or viewers away from you know, my channel but I think that might be better particularly because there's been times particularly at the start and indeed now as I'm talking where Max is doing some weird fucking shit you're gonna miss out on if you Oh, yeah, this Yeah,

Robb Olson 1:09:15

like when we were when we were talking, he was just like pretending to read the book or maybe he was actually reading the book. Yes. So the video video editions are going to be Yeah, a little bit a little bit extra for you for sure.

Michael David Wilson 1:09:28

Yeah, yeah. Didn't even acknowledge that you disappeared or do I leave the room and yeah, he is off again. Quite the video presentation

well, in terms of in terms of The next segment Hey guys. Welcome.

Max Booth III 1:10:03

Feel free to leave that in. I'm okay with it. I vomited the coffee out of my nose all over myself.

Michael David Wilson 1:10:12

Seriously?

Robb Olson 1:10:14

Why didn't you do that on camera?

Unknown Speaker 1:10:20

Okay

Max Booth III 1:10:22

when all over the ground all my clothes It was disgusting. All because I sat next question that you said next question is for Rob. He wasn't expecting that. Just fucking shot it out of every orifice on my face. Oh my god, that was gross. She was listening to the

Michael David Wilson 1:10:46

podcast you used you may be

Max Booth III 1:10:51

listening. Yeah. Just some some context for the listeners only I've changed clothes mid podcast. Ridiculous. Yeah. Because Michael said, the next question is for Rob. That was it.

Robb Olson 1:11:11

For the record, we're all three of us professional like podcasters. Like, we all know what we're doing. And we have a lot of experience.

Max Booth III 1:11:21

Yeah. Taking my socks off now because they have gotten soggy with coffee vomit. Yeah.

Robb Olson 1:11:28

Yeah. I mean, that was one of the stories.

Max Booth III 1:11:31

Yeah, I wasn't expecting any. I mean, I didn't plan that to happen. I'm not going to apologize, because I believe it will make podcast gold. But guess what happens?

Michael David Wilson 1:11:45

It is truly astounding. And perhaps marginally worrying that if you kind of total, the podcast experience that the three of us have together, it must be very close to three decades. And this is. This is cumulative three decades of podcast and we'll get you. Coffee,

Max Booth III 1:12:07

maybe I think I began. I began podcasting, I think in 2017. Hold about you guys.

Michael David Wilson 1:12:15

So this is how I started in February 2013.

Robb Olson 1:12:22

April 2011. So I've gotten 1212, almost 13 years.

Max Booth III 1:12:28

Wow, has anyone ever lost farmer to the coffee on the podcast?

Robb Olson 1:12:33

No, my building was on fire one time

Michael David Wilson 1:12:39

might not be the same. And it wasn't the direction that I planned on taking this. But you gotta tell us the story.

Robb Olson 1:12:48

That Well, I have this kind of thing. I was thinking about this. Because like, there has been some drama in the apartment below me. And I was like, if there's gunfire or something, I don't know if I'm gonna, I'm gonna try and just like continue recording. But I was in I was living in Vermont at the time. And I was living in this like, five storey building. And it was right before someone that we were interviewing was about to join the call. No, they had just joined the call, but we hadn't started the actual interview yet. And all of a sudden, there's just this like, alarm sound. And I knew it was in my building. And Livius is like, what's that noise. And I was like, kind of more annoyed than anything because everything was set and we're ready to go and we're just doing this thing. And it was like the fire alarms going off. So I had to like get up and go downstairs and find out what's going on. Someone's kitchen was on fire or something like that. But it was nothing where I had to evacuate. So it's like let's just do this because like the fire alarm had stopped going so that wasn't gonna affect the audio. So like someone's kitchen was on fire, but I just push through.

Max Booth III 1:13:55

It's pretty awesome.

Robb Olson 1:13:57

Nothing stops me about guessing man.

Max Booth III 1:14:01

Kills to me now that what happened with me can be described as a release. And now release. And I don't feel good. I'm a little ashamed to be honest.

Michael David Wilson 1:14:16

Yeah, I mean, what we've we've all had post release shame at some point in our life. So I think there'll be a bit that a lot of our listeners can connect with so that's good.

Max Booth III 1:14:30

Some of the release Scott. refilled it on the video. I don't know how much of it was on my cam. They came right out of my mouth and my nose. That was painful. Oil painful releases right?

Michael David Wilson 1:14:49

Occasionally.

Max Booth III 1:14:53

This is a hill part of the house right?

Michael David Wilson 1:14:58

Yeah, you need to think about 15 minutes ago we were gonna jump into another story and it all got derailed with one simple question. What do you want to talk about

Max Booth III 1:15:15

about fish and the zombies failure right

so yes

Robb Olson 1:15:26

all right, you know what can I take the reins on this because like I have a story that I need to talk about so

Michael David Wilson 1:15:35

you need to talk about a year from your life

Robb Olson 1:15:43

so yeah, by the way, this one time. No I gotta find it. Every breath is a choice is that yeah, yeah. I want to make sure that's the right one. Yeah,